You summed it up well here.

As an aside, the real angry rhetoric being made on the AH issue are those who push the discrimination angle as their platform to argue from. However that is simply not only wrong, it is factually wrong about what Novato is - being pretty much the most diverse city in ethnically and economically in Marin with already the most per capita AH in it. Yet this derogatory claim does a good enough job in creating fear, uncertainty, and doubt to unaware regular people that might want to speak out about it, but certainly are worried about being labeled for it. It's an old technique since civilization.

I think even beyond this, folks are seeing the social engineering that is being forced on us by the state and federal government. Mandates for specific housing in Novato make some of us think how can the government rezone my property, that I have paid on for years, and make it so the only use is affordable housing. I have lost the ability to use my property as I wish, within the codes, so that others from, who knows where, can move here to make life better for them. What about the folks that are already here and worked hard to get their little bit of the American Dream? What about the neighbors that bought their homes in the neighborhoods that they liked because of the peaceful and safe character? The picture is much bigger than just Novato. What is going on in Novato is just a small part of how we are losing control of our lives and the government is telling us what is best for us. Oh, and by the way, big brother is not only going to tell you how to design your town but you are going to pay for it, that is if you pay taxes.

He was sponging off of his girlfriend, who's grandmother was providing housing for the granddaughter. The granddaughter had completed classes as a care provider and was trying to make a better life for her and her daughter. Now the granddaughter is in jail as an accomplice, of this scumbag, in the attempted murder. The scumbag, in addition to being charged with attempted murder, who has previously been deported, is also charged with sex with a minor on an unrelated case,

Bob, you say the grandmother was providing housing for the granddaughter and her scumbag boyfriend.....well there's going to be more of that in the new Eden houseing off Diablo. And also the grandddaughter is a scumbag too. She drove the get away car. She's just as guilty. When you make bad decisions were attempted murder/murder is involved you best expect the consequences even if you are a mother of a young child. I hope her baby daughter will be raised by someone who will break the cycle.

Christine, I don't disagree with you. The gal was given an opportunity to have a good and honest life and she chose to follow the scumbag and she will have to be accountable. My point was to T. Allen in that although the scumbag lived in San Marin he was not a productive person in our society. He found a place to live by sponging off of this gal, who without Mr. Scumbag in her life, may have been a productive citizen, but that was her choice........When I think of Senior housing I think of the Novaro Complexes which have been well managed and not a burden to our city while providing housing for low income seniors. Time will tell if Eden housing can provide low income housing for seniors without being a blight on our community. To qualify to live there one only needs to be 55 years of age, which seems young to me. At that age I suppose the occupants could have gang banger children. At the City Council meeting to give Eden the ok to build, it was not clear to me what control was in place to prevent the senior from moving in a child under 55 or what consequences were in place if the child living there were convicted of a crime. One concern is that the good citizen senior will be living across the street from Wyndover and may be a target for any criminals that live or visit there.

Dinah, Here is the description of the Eden Senior Housing:
Warner Creek Senior Housing, Eden Housing’s second development in Marin County, will feature 60 new affordable rental homes for lower income seniors, an on-site manager’s unit, a creek-side courtyard, several community spaces for resident activities, a computer learning center, and resident gardens. Residents living at Warner Creek will have access to a supportive resident services program designed to help them “age in place” and live independently for as long as possible. Warner Creek is located near the downtown in close proximity to transit and amenities, and will also include many sustainable features for energy and water conservation. Warner Creek will be affordable to senior households earning 20% to 50% of the Marin County Area Median Income, and will include twenty-two units targeted to seniors with long-term chronic health conditions.

...then you should probably pull back and take a deep breath. Real issues as brought up here are real issues. Comments on an open forum are going to bring in at times interesting people making wild comments, sometimes distasteful. However you might consider thinking on this: There is a "Flag as inappropriate" link on every post. If you know clicking that is not really true - than perhaps it is just really an opinion being made you need to not react so much to be dismayed about.

Ella
Marcus is very smart. While you may not think this discussion is productive, I would politely beg to differ. I think the discussion is very helpful and productive no matter which side you are on. I think we have more commentary on local government than we have in years (and City Council members have discussed the fact that they benefit from citizen involvement!). The discussion about housing values is an absolute abstract, and is simply rhetoric. Housing values are solely determined by the free market, nothing more, nothing less. If you are dismayed by the issues, then get involved to make a positive change for the better. Don't blame free ideas floating around on Patch, as they are only opinions of people who seem to be passionate about what is happening in the community.

The problem with what you are saying is that it is largely anecdotal, and erroneous. The fact is Novato is the most ethnically diverse city in Marin. Also I margin it is also the most economically diverse as well (over Rafael), with more spread of homeless to millionaires in this city than in any other city in Marin. Novato also per capita has the most affordable housing developments already built than any other city in Marin. You dived into the political hyperbole - and your "tea party take over" comments illustrate you as actually making your comments come from a political agenda than talking directly on the matter.

No - there is healthy adult minded debate going on. Novato's residents complaining about being Marin's dumping ground for higher density of low income housing with gifting of tax waivers and etc., and the stress it has put upon the long term infrastructure of the city, is not "hate" for low income people. In fact you can make a case that some low income people may not want more of that too for various good reasons. I advise you attempt to see it in structural terms instead of emotional rhetoric, which is largely false.

The "Marinites" looking down on Novato you speak of probably are in cities that make great calls for feel-good politics to Marin needs, but not in their backyards where there really has been no AH development. The hypocrisy on this topic in Marin is massive, but the agenda is obvious.

Whitney- i know how you feel. I moved my family here just before the AH "debate" fired up and, although we bought a market rate- single family house, we were very turned off by what we read on patch. We felt the town zeitgeist was unwelcoming and exclusive. We have since made some friends and heard enough rational voices that I can say the negative majority exists only on patch. good luck finding a home, if you choose Novato you will be welcomed by many!

Whitney,
You reference meetings throughout the county- Is this the same Whitney connected to Greenbelt Alliance ;(The Miles Away from Home report) and Live Local Marin? Both in the pocket of Marin Community Foundation with a hugh agenda of pushing Marin's affordable housing into Novato. The same Whitney who who spoke to the Novato City Council on several occasions on the importance of high density/affordable housing? Please tell me, while you are shopping for the largest investment of your life, will you be looking at property next to potential high density sites? Or possibly, in the same neighborhood as Wyndover?

Whitney:

What the rational hard working citizens of Novato object to is having a bunch of institutional bureacrats from Sacramento and wealthy special interest groups for developers tell our community what type and density of housing that we must build. That is blatantly unconstituttional and Un-American.

You use the terms hate and vitirol towards anyone who has a viewpoint different from yours. You need to take a class in remedial grammar. And BTW - Where do concoct this tea party crap? How dare you have the audacity to insult my fellow novato citizens voicing their opinions about their community. If you are so concerned about the lack of affordable high density housing, may I suggest that you lobby your Ross Valley communities to build their share of affordable housing.

From Novato With Love.

Marcus
Thanks for your thoughts. I know a lot of highly educated people that are simply trying to get on with their lives, working hard, and are open minded to trying new ideas to solve issues in our wonderful town. Your comment about agreeing with Whitney is predictable, and is not important. Looking at presently viable ways to solve the AH issue would be more productive. We have had prior discussions about the idea of foreclosures, and you (I think) indicated some support for that idea...but did not believe that would get very far, but in my mind at least it is a good start (and infinitely better than the Ross' answer-making the Art and Garden Center a site for AH-which is a very chilling and telling zoning). We should consider carrying on this idea-you have a lot of power, I don't...if you want to get together and get some ideas put out, I am all for it.

There are very few extreme views or anger here, or narcissistic pleasure followers here that I can see. There certainly can me some on an open comments section. Unless that is just personal opinion based on some personal assumptions, you should talk then directly to it and speak of what that is for you instead of your obvious vagueness. Or do you mean to just demean debate by insult and claim a lack of open minded people on Patch, by your austere assumption?

Curious on a web search, are you the one the Novato Advance says is a CPA working for companies that invest in Affordable Housing in Novato?

Yes, understand. Can we meet to discuss options tomorrow at say 10am? Scottsdale pond cleanup..I will be there then or like 10 minutes later...I have to take a girlfriend on her first motorcycle ride at 9...Lets do this...if you can...if not that is fine too, but I know you are the most erudite one that can discuss with me.....

Good luck at tennis (I mean this in not Nadal/Djo however you spell it), catch up soon. Soccer hard!... we will do soon. Thanks, I do value your ideas a lot

Sylvia
Great post! I vaguely remember reading about the family that got the refurbished home, and I thought that was such a great idea. I had no idea that they are doing 18 homes!...that is really great news. It is great to see a group that is thinking outside the box...foreclosed homes create blight in many cases, and this can serve to get a home "back in use"..and with interest rates at record lows, this is a great time for people to get in...and utlimately, this costs a heck of a lot less than $400k per unit that Eden is costing...and contributes to the tax base...Thanks again!

I think most people are behind this in some way since it makes sense, but the question still needs to be answered if they count against a community's mandated "quota" of AH. Without that really confirmed, applying this to the AH conversation is foggy and not helpful.

Another question is for those neighborhoods, if these homes are bought in some density to a given area, if this effects the comp value of their homes to people already living there. Now of course, that conversation can be moot - since the market of bank owned homes itself is a drag, but the question is if the rate for the "sale" is significantly less than what would have been if on the open market? It's a sticky question for sure due to the housing crunch, but one to ask anyway (I like all kinds of info regardless). The article you referenced is feel-good for sure, which I like too, but the critical minded side of me understands there is more to the story than one example as well.